Was Jesus punished primarily for sin??
I am super excited to have come across these videos as for some time now, this has been the very thing on my heart. A couple years back in a conversation with a friend, he mentioned in passing, how the view held in many "grace" circles that the Sole purpose of the Cross was to appease our sin before God, by having the Father smash/punish the Son on our behalf was rather cruel. Even though it had great benefits for us, it had led him to ask questions of the Fathers Nature..... can this be True Love??.... an Exacting Father at a distance enforcing required Legal punishment on the innocent?
I didn't think much on his comments at the time, but as the months have gone by and Holy Spirit has shown me more of Fathers amazing Love for us all, He has also reminded me of my friends' statement. All of a sudden, I saw that His Love for me made no sense unless He was fully, personally involved in my Redemption - and not buying me back using His Son's life. He was Fully, Intimately involved because that's how valued we are to Him!!
Some (incorrectly) say:
"The Father cant look upon sin, so Jesus had to come to fix that....", Or "Jesus had to appease the Fathers wrath towards us"
Firstly,
Sin is not the Issue!! Sin was never the issue... for God loved and died for us "while we were still sinners!!!!!
The REAL issue was our SHAME that sin caused!! (Adam in the Garden - hiding and shameful).
Shame prevents us from RECEIVING and living in relationship with Father that He always intended.
Religion teaches us that "God cannot look on sin???".... However, the reality tells us something exactly opposite! "Adam, where are you...." He said. God was looking for the sinner....
Not to punish him, but to walk in communion with him as He had done since his creation.
(Placing them outside the Garden was not to punish them, but rather was an act of Love so He could restore us back before they could eat of the Tree of Life and forever be in a state of separation from God in their own hearts).
He came to seek and save the Lost.... we all like sheep have gone astray... but He goes out to look for us. FRIENDS... God (Father, son and Spirit) looks at the sinner, and deeply loves him!! Religion teaches that God is angry with sinners... Yet Jesus, who only did what the Father did and said, was found to be the "friend of sinners". How mixed up have we got it these days??!!
His love for the entire world (sinners), convincingly displayed in the most profound and greatest way - a man laying him life down for his friend - even though his friends are all enemies and sinners... This Love act on the Cross has the power to remove our shame and guilt so that we can receive Him again as our Husband - and we, His Bride.
The Cross Divorces us from the Law by our Co-crucifixion with Christ (Rom 7) - ending that Old Contract of Death, Shame and Condemnation. Instead our Marriage with Christ involves NO condemnation OR Shame because sin (the cause of our shame) is removed as far as the east is from the west and remembered no more.
Our marriage is one on the grounds of Grace. He did it all, we only Believed it and received it as a Gift.
In fact - when we feel any sense of Shame, we have begun to drift from Grace. The word in Greek for "Shame" actually means: "DIS-GRACE" (an undoing of Grace)
If we are living in Shame, we have forgotten the Good News of the New Covenant. - The Good News boldly tells us that God has "Scorned and Despised" shame because it separates YOU from him - not Him from you. - Nothing in all of creation has the power to do that. We are on his mind 24/7.
His love empowers us to love others. We cannot truly trust Him if we dont see His unconditional love for us. For example, Paul (Saul) - The Christian Killer - has a face to face encounter with Jesus - who's followers He is murdering and instead of receiving wrath- as he would have expected, he receives the exact opposite.... He receives UNCONDITIONAL LOVE and a clear revelation of the cross .... and changed! He was Compelled by Gods Love for people as He had experienced it himself.
He saw Gods nature in fullness revealed - not just the shadow of the Old Testament, and that He is ABBA and He is LOVE.
He did it all... He was there on the Cross, in all His Fullness. It was not the Son alone taking the punishment for our sin and fulfilling the Joy of our reconciliation to Himself, but God was IN Christ, reconciling the world to Himself!
Jesus even said that this was so, just before the Cross He said... "the Father is in me and I in the Father". He wouldn't miss being a part of the action that had been planned since before the foundation of the world!! He loves us too much to miss our Home coming!
Enjoy the Videos:
Loads of Love
Andrew
You say that religion teaches that God is angry with sinners but it was Jesus himself who said: "Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them." - John 3:36
ReplyDeleteGod's wrath is directed at every one of us until we are born again. For the Christian there is now no condemnation but for everyone else there is wrath and anger (Romans 2:8).
However, God IS love and if it were not for His love towards us (yes, while were were still sinners) then we would have never have been saved in the first place! (see Ephesians 2:8-9). You can't say it's one or the other - either God is loving towards sinners or he's angry at them (that's a false dichotomy). It's actually both, and it is because of his love and grace that he comes to forgive us - to give us what we have not earned and what we do not deserve. He saves us from his wrath by punishing Jesus in our place (who willingly gave his life for us) - that is the Gospel!
Hi Anon. Thank you for your comments!!
ReplyDeleteI think it will be more helpful to reply to as a separate blog post on "the wrath of God" as it would benefit more people reading it as a blog, and not just a comment.
I completely hear from where you are coming from as its a position I used to hold to too.
I will get on with that post in the next week hopefully.
Cool, chat soon :)
Andrew
Hi Anon - haven't had time to write, but here are a few thoughts anyway:
ReplyDeleteyou stated:
"You say that religion teaches that God is angry with sinners but it was Jesus himself who said: "Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them." - John 3:36
These are the words of John the Baptist, but never the less, days earlier Jesus was telling them that God is Loving towards all men -("the world" - Cosmos) - believers AND non-believers, and will not condemn them.
"Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved."
"but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them."
There are a few words used in Greek that translate into the word "life". This one Jesus uses is "Zoe". It is the type of God-life that only comes from Him as a gift to all who trust in His Son. If one, refuses to trust the work of the Son they cant experience this free gift (Salvation) - BUT their rejection DOES NOT make God angry*, rather it stirs His passion and desire** for them even more - that they would yet taste and see His delight in doing only GOOD to them (Jer 32:40-41).
(*Isa 54:9 For this is as the waters of Noah unto me: for as I have sworn that the waters of Noah should no more go over the earth; so have I sworn that I would not be wroth with thee, nor rebuke thee.(KJV)
** The word "Wrath" by definition has NOTHING to do with Anger but Rather refers to Gods "Desire" and "Passion" (which is love flavoured - vs 16) resting on them.
The implicated passionate indignation or vengeance side of "wrath" is NOT directed toward its object of desire!!! But, rather its towards that which would harm it - sin!
Thats what HE ACCOMPLISHED in Himself on the Cross... against sin:
Rom 8:1 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh,
His wrath (ie, His desire/passion for US, and His indignation/vengeance against sin)was shown for us all to see when "He made Him Who knew no sin to become sin (noun)..." (2 Cor 5:21)
John 3:18 "He that believeth in Him is not condemned (also:"Judged") ; but He that believeth not is condemned(also:"Judged") already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Jesus then in the very next verse TELLS US what the condemnation/judgement for NOT Believing is - AND he says that THEY ARE ALREADY under this Decision of His. It is not a future Decision, but a Past Decision!!
3:19 And this is the judgment: that the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light, because their deeds were evil.
Because they reject the Gospel, God made a decision/judgement about them, that they prefer evil and darkness. He does not condemn them but intensely desires to win them over with His Love and Goodness (Rom 2:4).
He showed this Decision/Judgement throughout HIs life that He (God) was A "FRIEND OF SINNERS" (Luke 15:1), That He "came into the world to save sinners"(1 Tim 1:15)
In other words this Judgement of GOD that Unbelievers were under was TO BENEFIT THEM, NOT TO HARM THEM. To draw them back to Him.. to LOVE them back to their senses:
Rom 2:4 Don't you know that the reason God is good to you is because he wants you to turn to him? (CEV)
As I have grown in my understanding of His amazing Love and Grace, even His "Wrath" has become for me a beautiful attraction to Him. How deep the Fathers Love for us, How vast beyond all measure!!